Is This The Bigfoot Community?
Sometimes when you're in the midst of it all, you forget that we're all seeking the same answer. It makes you wonder if the constant back and forth between people in the Bigfoot community are causing casual observers to step away from the field, wondering if this is something they want to involve themselves in.
One casual observer and blogger named Storm notices the infighting and wishes the "community" would just grow up:
While Sasquatch is not my primary area of interest, I have been watching the goings on in Bigfoot circles with some amusement these days. I am reminded of a group of children on the playground in elementary school. There is an awful lot of pushing and shoving (especially amongst the boys), the bigger kids are bullying the smaller kids and there is a general feeling of chaos and disorder that no amount of teacher intervention can overcome. Anyone who has ever had charge of such a scene knows that all you can do is keep the kids from hurting themselves and each other.
In a so-called community in which a group of people is attempting to verify the existence of a creature from legend, you would think that there would be more open mindedness. Instead, you see people drawing battle lines wherever they go. Passionate arguments break out over whether Sasquatch is a hominid or an ape, about how the creatures behave i.e. are they shy and avoid humans or are they curious and attracted to humans, do they stalk and hunt deer, are the little 'shelters' found in some locales really Bigfoot nests, etc. I have seen an argument on a Bigfoot forum about the color of eye shine for these animals. And when I say that these arguments are passionate, I am being charitable; the term flame war enters my mind.
[...]
My point to the Bigfoot "community" is this, though. You have the cart before the horse, folks. Before you can argue about the habits of this creature and whether is is more closely related to apes or humans, you actually have to find one and convince the scientific community that the critter exists. To do that is going to require a systematic, long term effort on the part of someone or some group of someones, not tramping around in the woods on weekends and vacations with a thermal imager hoping to get lucky. It is time, from this outsider's point of view, for the Bigfoot community to grow up and start looking for ways to field teams of highly trained individuals who are familiar with scientific evidence recovery procedure, tracking, stalking, surveillance, capture and tagging instead of hanging around waiting for the next big publicity stunt to argue about.
[via thewolfseyes.blogspot.com]
True enough. I think everybody wants to be first here, they all want to be the one to crack this mystery and now that none of them will crack it (it's likely getting cracked soon by - of all things - a female scientist) everybody's acting like confused ants crawling on each other's backs. It's quite a mess right now, I think they're all basically worried it'll all be over very soon for most of them. Fun and games finito, seriousness sets in and not the ants but the Krantz take over.
ReplyDeleteBrilliant comments, Storm! I am sick of the trolls riding around on the BF sites to say BF doesn't exist or to pick on the looks of the people in photographs. It's ridiculous and rather pathetic. I come onto this blog because information moves fast and there are a few choice intelligent people chiming in. If we could all continue intelligent conversation, it would bode well for BF's future when he is verified to exist. Imagine if the powers that be acted like the childish people on BF sites when they have to make split second decisions about how to preserve, protect, observe, and understand BF. Yikes.
ReplyDeleteTrolls because they look at the same evidence as everyone and decide it is a hoax or fishy at least in there eyes? Or is it trolls because we post anonymously? Maybe some people could work on there delivery but to say there are only a few choice intelligent people chiming in is ridiculous. The forum is public and the anonymous tag is there so deal with it and stop making yourself look so sophisticated and realize you have called people liars and put researchers down yourself. Cant we all just get along?
DeleteIt's not for me to speak in Autmn's behalf, but I'll give you my interpretation of "trolls".
DeleteFirst off, it would be nice to know who is commenting. I don't have a problem with the Anonymous comments, but it would be great if the person commenting at least used an initial(s),or a made up name. Some Anon posters already do this.Then at least we know who to address for a debate,rebuttal etc.
To me trolls are the people who come here and poke people like bullies do. Name calling,derogatory comments about a person's occupation, weight, looks etc.
These people also contribute nothing to the conversation. If something is fake or a hoax to someone, at least have the intelligence to offer opinions as to why something is fake. Examples: Arms are too short, hair looks like fake fur,subject is too short, thin, walks funny etc.
Simply jumping on here and saying something like "that slob made it up, it's fake" offers nothing to the table of discussion.
I believe Bigfoot is real, but I have come across intelligent skeptics who offer valid reasons for Bigfoot's non-existance.
It has nothing to do with an Anonymous post, it has more to do with an intelligent post.
Cheers
Excellent post SasquaiNation.
Deleteyou got more nerve than a sore tooth lady, this and other blogs in the BF world are not only for you to comment on are they? first off this is still america and that little thing called freedom of speach still is valid. if someone wishes not to use their name than so be it!(it is an option that is there) most of these people don't get to hang out with the moneymakers and the bo-bo's like you do. so if these HATERS as you say bother you then don't look honey. i'm sick of people crying cause someone was offended. again this is america and that's just the way it is here. as for your so called mean comments that's just how people are feeling especially when super-tools who think they just know all there is to know about sasquatch. and you think people aren't going to be negative autumn forest. christ have you seen the unemployment rate in our country. people are losing their homes. this is an angry nation/society right now and if that offends you then well just to f-ing bad lady. unlike us autumnforest some people just don't believe in bigfoot! and that's ok too. so of course they will say nasty things. it's just human nature girl. we live in a fast paced society and sometimes people's feelings may get hurt. i've posted straight talk and some nasty talk too. but i don't claim to hang out with bigfoots and know how many children they average per couple. geeze their isn't a f-ing body and some bozo tells me that they have 2.5 offspring. how the hell can someone say that without a case study autunmforest. right? that's why people are negative when they are reading fiction told as some known fact.
DeleteToday is pink shirt day (which is the red cross anti-bullying day)
DeleteI think we have to remember that some posters here are being bullies. Yes they have the right to say what they feel. But this blog is MEANT for intelligent conversation, not name calling and bullying. There is even a drive to get bullying declared a hate crime in the US. (Then free speech does not apply). Not only they but some comments could land a person in court for defimation of character and public slandering. (That's an exception to free speech).
As SasquaiNation pointed out. Lets not attack everyone's character's. If you don't agree with the topic/photo/video, etc. that is fine, say so and WHY. Don't go and fire granades and missles at the person or claim they are perpatrating crimes just because you dissagree with their statement or evidence. How would you like it if you released evidence and everyone and their dog blasted you, called you names and said you were committing a crime and should go to prison???
Hate has no place in this world, free speech or not.
Chad
Zobo,
DeleteI happen to disagree with you about your thinking. It is one thing for something to be legal, it is another thing to do it. For instance, I know of no law saying that picking your nose is illegal. Yet in public, how many of us would pick our nose? Likewise, even if there is no law saying that calling ______ a _______ (insert person and rude term here,) would it be acceptable to do it? I think if someone offers valid reasons for there. No one said it was against the laws to be anonymous. I believe the only thing said is that, sure enough, we are arguing. I personally read through my post at least three times before to make sure it isn't offending anyone needlessly. If we live in a fast-paced society, we simply need to be polite and brief. For instance, instead of your post, if I wanted to be quick, I would say:
I don't agree with you. I feel that this violates freedom of speech. Of course I am inclined to disagree when researchers put their own ideas out as facts, like in that 2.5 babies to bigfoot post. If researchers clearly stated this was only a theory, people would be less negative.
If you lived slower paced, you could write a longer and polite answer. And I am not debating that this is sad times and sad times make people angry. I write a journal of insults and things I hate when I am mad, and I don't show it to anyone. If we were a little nicer maybe we wouldn't have people lashing out.
By the way, I forgot to mention. This is not a purely american blog
Deletei will try harder to be a better/kinder bigfoot blogger. i take what you said as advice and i thank you for it. seriously kittalia! woke up on the wrong side of the bed and that's not this blogs problem. that i know. trying not to sound too soft. after all i'm a large male!lol!! plus i will shorten my opinions.not that too many?if any one cares. peace,love and hairy wild pep-apes!
DeleteThe comments expressed by the writer strike me as naive. Specifically, he/she is suggesting a vague course of action that HAS been attempted numerous times over the past fifty years. Some expeditions have been very successful (Skookum Expedition in 2000, One hundred tracks collected near Londonl Ore. just the other day.) There is lots of good evidence that has been collected. The public just doesn't get to hear about it. Still, The lack of greater success by organized efforts probably reflects a fundamental mis-understanding of the phenomeonon that tainted their approach and imapaired their chances of success. (Perhaps the degree of disagreement that exists within the research community is justified.) In any case, I dispute the view that the healthy disagreement is analagous to playground squabble. Indeed, the rancor that exists today is far less than it was in the recent past, and things are much more amicalbe now than any time I recall within the past twenty years. You shouldda been here when Beckjord was alive...
ReplyDeleteI was around wwhen beckjerk as a I call him back then was on his soap box talking all his BS. It was the same kind of childish arguements as now, but back then it was based on the biggotry and bias that some still propogate now, so i disagree with your disagreement on the writers ideas. If you are calling him naive then so are you.
DeleteIf you think about it, your words could seem insulting an pompus to the writer, also thats the problem with Bigfooters, sometimes they can be groups of self rigtheous drama queens.
So i believe you are wrong that is any different now then from 20 years ago. Whats different is Like the very eloquent Atumfrost stated, the web can spit out and digest tons of information, so i disagree wiht you once again that the community is not well informed, what i thinks is that wiht in the information is bad information.
No disrespect Mr Powell, just my opinion if you disagre i do not give a hoot :)
Sasquatchery...
DeleteAgreed Thom...nice to hear from you sir. Great cooperative efforts on the London trackway...as an example of how to work together respectfully.
Folks would do well to remember...in the final analysis this is about the "big folks" not us.
live and let live...
Steve Summar
There is Steve Summars,Trying to pass himself off as an innocent observer, just full of niceties.
DeleteLooks like he is coming back full force after taking a step back for a while after being booted from the Alabama forum for inciting a 'shit storm' behind the curtains.
Just keep your wits about you when dealing with Summars. He starts off as a charming do-gooder, up front. While splitting and dredging behind the scene. Watch out! He has come out from under his rock.
DeleteThom, I agree with some of what you said and I also agree with some of what Photo Blahhh! said.
DeleteIt does seem like their are "camps" in the Bigfoot community. It doesn't have so much to do with the big names in the field, I believe it has more to do with the supporters of the big names. Some follow Matt's camp, some are on Dr. Meldrum's side and others agree more with David Paulides and Scott Nelson.
People do get passionate about their opinions which can result in heated tempers, But I've never heard of any of the big name folks going at each other.If it has occurred, I'm sure someone will correct me.
The London Trackway gathering is and was a prime example of team work within the community and should be applauded. I for one was thrilled to read how everyone from different "camps" pulled together to accomplish what has been done.
That's my two coppers :)
I once heard someone refer to humans as "humanzees"- like chimpanzees we align ourselves with a group i.e./religion/tribe/belief- draw a line in the sand and damn/dehumanize the others. We are not the only species that goes to war and most of our "us vs them" conflicts are analogous to the violent "wars" rival groups of chimps engage in. IMO this does not bode well for the future of our species or, indeed, the prospect of respectful disagreements (online or off).
ReplyDeleteYou kids quit jumping on that pile of sheet metal
ReplyDeleteand go inside and help your Ma!
The elided paragraph reads:
ReplyDelete"While I am convinced that there is something in the woods that is causing these reports, as I have said in other posts, I am not entirely convinced that Sasquatch is a native of this dimension. Bigfoot researchers are notorious for overlooking reports that do not fit into their pet theory about the animal (i.e. those reports that put Bigfoot in the vicinity of UFO's or that have the creature vanishing into thin air). While researchers seem glad to have the assistance of Native people in finding "hot spots", they tend to ignore the legends of these people which state plainly that what we call a Sasquatch is a spiritual being."
While "Storm" may be correct about disputes among sasquatch researchers, they have proven beyond any doubt that they are an idiot, and exactly the kind of moonbat that makes otherwise open-minded people roll their eyes when the topic comes up.
LOL, seriously? It's the interdimensional crazies that are the main reason nobody in mainstream science wants to touch the Bigfoot issue.
DeleteYahtzee!
ReplyDeleteWell said Storm. I have been saying the same thing for years. We are trying to prove this creature is real to the scientific community.
ReplyDeleteAll the photos, Foot-cast, dna samples in the world will never prove anything without a specimen to compare it to. And to do that we need to work together put personal feelings aside and work as a group.
Sadly that will never happen why? Because of just what happen this pass weekend a photo which doesn't prove anything is released. Nice picture real or not but what does it prove nothing. But a entire weekend was wasted on people opinion. And if you said something that group A didn't like then the fight began. or if someone in group B has a personal problem with a person in group A then it became a gang fight. Does this really get us any closer to the truth no it just sets us back. And makes us look like fools to the outsiders.
I've been doing this for over 10 yrs and every few years something like what happen this past weekend comes out grabs everyone attention and proves nothing other than brings up old wounds.
There are no experts in the field of Bigfoot research there are those that have been doing it longer than others. But I repeat THERE ARE NO EXPERTS. Why can I say this because to become a expert you have to have one to study... All we have is a bunch of nice souvenirs. A bunch of people with holier than now attitudes. Because they have been on TV,a radio show, have spoken at a conference, published a book. Does that mean their knowledge is better than mine no does that mean their research is better than mine no. Will science ever take us seriously no. I know this will never happen but we need to work together everyone. We need to start sharing information put our difference aside and work as one. Because as long as we keep bashing each other because of something that happen a year ago we will still be right where we're at right now no where. I know some will agree with me others will not. This is my two cents on this matter.
The problem with his argument is that if Bigfoot is discovered by "real scientist", all of these Bigfoot boards and blogs will just slowly die. Everyone is screaming and fighting now, because if they are "found", there will be nothing to talk about other than "see I told you so" for a month or two.
ReplyDeleteHow many of you visit your favorite Cheetah forum? You don't, you find a website, wiki or book on the subject.
that is one of the best posts ever read on this site sir. cause like you said once the body is found that's it! for the what if's and the could you imagine's talk that goes with sasquatch ledgend. then super-tools david koresh(lindsay),and the cab-driver(fatsano) might have to pretend they are experts in another field! say socialist and stalker come to my mind. oop's i don't want to offend our readers,or come off as some big bad bully.NOT! but again your comments were right on point dude!
DeleteHi everyone, I must admit I am late to the party as far as who is who in the Squatch world. I have lived in the pnw my whole 34 years on Earth and drew my own conclusions regarding the existence of BF's long ago based on personal experience, only since I caught wind of the DNA project have I started fallowing the blogs like this one.
ReplyDeleteI must say in principle I agree with the post these comments pertain to, I also understand where the "BF hunters" are coming from. Putting yourself out there as a enthusiast is the same as stripping down naked and painting targets on yourself. It takes alot of guts to stand up for what you belive in and I applaud those who stick to their guns, in any walk of life.
As far as in-fighting, bickering and bulling go, look at politics, religion , look at pro sports, remember grade school, we are humans, its what we do. The stranger your hair cut, the more unique your beliefs the bigger of a target you become. And yes everyone wants to be first on this one, and many feel "entitled" to act like a**holes based on years and years of long colds nights in the woods, lost friendships, broken relationships ect...
I hate reality TV , dont even have cable, but who needs it when you got these guys.
Peace, Monkey
Whenever everyone agrees that Dyer is the best the world will a better place
ReplyDeleteI would have to disagree with you.
DeleteMr. Dyer has been proven to falsify evidence of Bigfoot and he has also been proven to falsify claims, and or information.
It's the nicest way I can put it> He may be a great friend, husband, father etc., but he has proven himself to be less than honest.
I only just found your email. It ended up in my Spam folder, I wonder why that is.
DeleteThanks for telling me to watch my step. You do that as well.
I see Bigfoottracker.com likes to make veiled threats.
Rick Dyer
Watch your step, You may slip and fall!!
Mike Miller
www.Bigfoottracker.com
Here's the email you sent me. Now everyone can see it. I look forward to your next email.
Kilroy was Here !
ReplyDeleteKulls likes Dyer, He calls Dyer up all the time for a chat, so Kulls is a chump too.
ReplyDeleteSadly, like everything else in this world, it all boils down to money, and I believe it even sometimes crosses the minds of those claiming to only be concerned for BF welfare and protection.
ReplyDeleteThis community has to be the strangest combination of personalities I've ever seen - an island of people trying to conduct themselves in a professional manner in a sea of the detrius of humanity. It is DANGEROUS to share information, lest some gun-toting redneck show up at your door, either wanting to prove you a hoaxer, steal your evidence or hunt BF on your property. I know people whose dogs have been poisoned and homes broken into. I know a list who have outstanding warrants for their arrest because of stalking, threats, breaking and entering, etc. I know of people forced out of their research areas at gunpoint and threatened with death if they talk. And then you have the bullies who commit equivalent crimes with their words online in their blogs, Facebook or chat boards - equally evil and dysfunctional in my mind. It is my prayer that the DNA study will settle the question of existence and that MOST of these folks will simply go away. However, I recognize that some will dig in their heels and continue to cause misery for the rest of us who are trying to do the right things by these beings. Honestly, some of these characters scare me to death.
ReplyDeletethe nation's debt should scare you sir not us mean big bad bullies bloggers!
DeleteThis community will never grow up or change. Why? pretty simple really. This is a hobby, and most hobbies like fishing, car racing etc you have to buy the items you need, and then strive for the 'awards'.
ReplyDeleteBiggest fish, best car etc which are all managed.
In BF theres none of this, grab a title a sh*t website and hey! your a researcher, no qualifications required, no organizations to answer to no nothing. Come one come all.
To make a bigger name in BF, buy a thermal or an HD camera and some cool tools and post to youtube...Yep that will sure do it.
Truth hurts.
the people on this web site that cry and complain about people not putting their name or photo on their blog can please stop wasting our time. cause they can also put a fake picture in that little block and just think of any name and they can put that there too. there is no f-ing diffrence baby's! you/we should be happy that this many people are intrested in the BF subject.good or bad! stop crying people. it's called freedom of speech! look i put my name up. and still nobody cares! man up girls! it's a harsh world outside of your computer screen1 remember?
ReplyDeleteWho said that everyone needs to have a name and photo? The only thing I found is that everyone should post some sort of a name or initials so that we don't have to say "anon at 06:39" and can be less confused. I don't see anything about pictures at all, either.
Delete-Kit
Hit the Nail on the Head, Storm!! Well Written, Well Said!! KUDOS!!
ReplyDelete